Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Reality, Realism, Fiction & Fantasy.

  1. #1
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,789

    Reality, Realism, Fiction & Fantasy.

    I found this subject quiet interesting, not only at a epistemological level but also as educational, rational, mind formation and dialogue generator (social). And also, of course which involve video games and the Internet.

    What is reality? Can we know/understand reality in its totality? what forms reality?
    Those epistemological questions have been fundamental to the understanding of how we create knowledge, but what is reality without fiction?

    Something I have found pretty interesting is that in epistemology most authors (not everyone) are focused on the reality but not in the fiction, which is left to metaphysic, but I believe we can't understand reality without fiction, because this obvious distinction we are making its the recognition of both working together (a duality? can we say that mind structuralist was right?).

    This idea that people have worked more and more reality than fiction go to the side, maybe, be the fact that people saw fiction in books, novels and comics, things that are outside of the reality (fiction existed and we have always live with it). But now, those things are not outside anymore, we learn from fiction at every moment, a prove is this same thread. This thread is a fiction, is not real, is not happening outside the world, but is a encryption of information added in another encryption. This thread is not real.

    But being this thread not real, we are active or passive participants of this, and not only that we can choose it. We can create fictions, chose to participate or to see, who we are and how we are. This make our life's being connected every day to the fiction, in which we learn a lot more than in reality (bold opinion).

    Video games are the same, they are fantasies which work on a level of realism to provide a fictionary experience while we are in our realities apart of it. Of course books, comics and others try to do the same, but was with video games when people could start becoming actors of the story, its when the movie become something to be acted and not watched.

    I bring this thread, to discuss about this. How do you believe fictionary experience is going to affect people (kids mostly)? Which are the believes or behaviors that are going to be sacrificed for the use of this new integration of the fiction in our world? How are going to evolve previous ways of art with this era of the new fiction? What would it happen when we become able to create our own reality on the fiction? Which are the implications of doing that? How is going this new dialogue between people of all around the world is going to be when this clash of fiction get to its max?

    And if you like, you can disagree with many of my statements. But discuss this, because fiction is becoming every day more relevant for social interaction and reality is become only important for discovery (it has always been like that? dialogues weren't built around fiction, and reality around discovery?).

  2. #2
    Super Senior Member Delphinus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    2,335
    i am 12 years old and what is this

    YOU ARE EDUCATED STUPID.

    (Okay, I sort of get what you mean, but your post is really unclear)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenn
    You forgot your F in Modesty.

  3. #3
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    4,789
    I was quiet disperse and of course my English skills might have a rol in this but basically is this:

    I want to discuss, what is reality, fiction, how they interact, their medias (art, radio, tv, etc), how this new medias interact (internet and video games) how we interact through all this, and how different context are creating new dialogues through these medias builded on fiction and reality.

    What I want to discuss is how fiction and reality coexist in our time, and how we use them to generate dialogues and creating new fictions and realities (as we understand that those are created by us). And all that thanks to be participants under this fiction.

  4. #4
    Fenn
    Guest
    Yeah I applaud your effort--English is a hard language--but I'm kinda confused too.

  5. #5
    Bad Enough Dude to Rescue the President Kodos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    2,870
    God dammit, Del, you beat me to the Time Cube reference!
    Quote Originally Posted by ClockHand View Post
    I found this subject quiet interesting, not only at a epistemological level but also as educational, rational, mind formation and dialogue generator (social). And also, of course which involve video games and the Internet.

    What is reality?
    To paraphrase Phillip K. Dick; reality is whatever doesn't go away when you stop believing in it.

    Can we know/understand reality in its totality?
    In theory I don't see why not. With the possible exception of what goes on beyond the event horizon of a black hole I can't think of anything that might be truly ineffable to the human mind. Well, also, what happened at the dawn of time. But I think that latter one might be more easily resolved than the former.

    what forms reality?
    Wibbly-wobbly timey-wimey... stuff.

    Or matter/energy. Take your pick.

    Those epistemological questions have been fundamental to the understanding of how we create knowledge,
    We don't create knowledge, we acquire it.

    but what is reality without fiction?
    Somewhat more boring, but still pretty fucking amazing. Just think - not one of the various mythological stories about the origins of humanity are even half as interesting as the truth. You are made from the ashes of dead stars - giant nuclear fireballs - and a result of a four billion year long process that continues to this very day. How cool is that?!

    Something I have found pretty interesting is that in epistemology most authors (not everyone) are focused on the reality but not in the fiction, which is left to metaphysic, but I believe we can't understand reality without fiction, because this obvious distinction we are making its the recognition of both working together (a duality? can we say that mind structuralist was right?).
    A person is entirely capable of understanding reality without being well versed in fiction. Granted, to conceive of a concept you need to be able to conceive of it's negation - which may be fallacious - but I don't think that's what you mean?

    That is to say in order for me to understand the concept of what it means to be an atheist, I must understand the concept of god, which is obviously fictitious. In order for me to understand the concept of my friend Frank being alive, I must be able to understand the concept of him being dead, which at this juncture in time is a falsehood - a fantasy.

    This idea that people have worked more and more reality than fiction go to the side, maybe, be the fact that people saw fiction in books, novels and comics, things that are outside of the reality (fiction existed and we have always live with it). But now, those things are not outside anymore, we learn from fiction at every moment, a prove is this same thread. This thread is a fiction, is not real, is not happening outside the world, but is a encryption of information added in another encryption. This thread is not real.
    This thread is real. You are mistaking "the concept of a thing" with the thing, I think.

    I can imagine a unicorn. This is real. What's real, however, is not a unicorn, but my conceptualization of one. The thought of the unicorn is real, but the unicorn itself is false.

    As for this thread, that's an even worse example because it does exist as electrons and other bits of energy and matter being stored in some places and accessed in others. I don't know enough about how the internet actually works to speak more eloquently on this, but I am sure Del or someone else does and can, and hopefully will.

    But being this thread not real, we are active or passive participants of this, and not only that we can choose it. We can create fictions, chose to participate or to see, who we are and how we are.
    We don't choose who we are. I mean, in practice we do, but technically speaking we don't. As I've said about free will before - the variables are so hideously complex and manifold that I don't think there can ever be a practical side to the knowledge that we are basically automatons - so it's easier to just pretend we have free will - but technically speaking we don't. Humans are made of matter and energy, and all matter and energy obey certain rules.

    This make our life's being connected every day to the fiction, in which we learn a lot more than in reality (bold opinion).
    Fiction is beyond worthless without reality. To imagine things one must have some sort of basis. Obviously we could never know but I daresay that if you took a human fetus and somehow engineered it such that when it was born it had no sensory input at all - just a mind - that it would be unable to do anything - even to imagine.

    Video games are the same, they are fantasies which work on a level of realism to provide a fictionary experience while we are in our realities apart of it. Of course books, comics and others try to do the same, but was with video games when people could start becoming actors of the story, its when the movie become something to be acted and not watched.
    Hey, what about choose your own adventure books!

    I bring this thread, to discuss about this. How do you believe fictionary experience is going to affect people (kids mostly)? Which are the believes or behaviors that are going to be sacrificed for the use of this new integration of the fiction in our world? How are going to evolve previous ways of art with this era of the new fiction? What would it happen when we become able to create our own reality on the fiction? Which are the implications of doing that? How is going this new dialogue between people of all around the world is going to be when this clash of fiction get to its max?
    Video games are an art form as legitimate as any other, yes. But most video games are not of any great artistic worth. Of course, the same is entirely true of movies. That said, we are a long ways off before video games will be seen as art by the mainstream. Additionally, given the increasing artistic death of most media and the growing rise of soulless cash-cows, I think it will be an even longer time before game developers are willing to seriously try using the art form to make, well, art.

    And if you like, you can disagree with many of my statements. But discuss this, because fiction is becoming every day more relevant for social interaction and reality is become only important for discovery (it has always been like that? dialogues weren't built around fiction, and reality around discovery?).
    Fiction cannot tell us anything about reality that reality itself could not. At most fiction can be used to help people understand things better by way of allegory.

    Do you like big boobs? Dragons? Ninja? Martial arts? Wizards? Then click here and make all your wildest dreams come true!!

  6. #6
    Fenn
    Guest
    Thanks for clarifying Kodos. I had always had trouble distinguishing between the existense of a thing and an idea. Because ideas like, say, Pokemon or Dragons, can oftentimes be extremely well known and influential. Sometimes it's difficult to draw the line!

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •