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Thread: School Sucks: Back to School ... AGAIN!?

  1. #471
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
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    You are saying that language is determinant in how reality is seeing. I do agree language work in the construction of reality, but it's not determinant, and so, colors are going to still be the same regardless the language; the distinction, or codes of distinctions we made, are bonded to our realities, medium and other variables, to finally by produced in our language. The language you speak doesn't "affect" how you perceive the world, but it does affect the how you communicate what you perceive in the world, making the whole social construction of reality a final product of what are you observing and how can you express it.

  2. #472
    Lucky Member corastaur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClockHand View Post
    You are saying that language is determinant in how reality is seeing. I do agree language work in the construction of reality, but it's not determinant and colors are going to still be the same, regardless the language; the distinction, or codes of distinctions we made, are bonded to our realities, medium and other variables, not the language. The language you speak doesn't "affect" how you perceive the world, but it does affect the how you communicate what you perceive in the world, making the whole social construction of reality a final product of what are you observing and how can you express it.
    I agree and disagree with you at the same time. Yes the language you speak won't change the colors or the information that your brain is taking in. All of that is going to be the same for pretty much everyone regardless of the language they speak or the culture they come from. BUT the language you speak will play a role in how your brain processes the information. Do you see what I mean? I guess your brain will probably process it the same way, but it affects how you think about the world around you. Right? So when you look at something blue, for example, your brain registers what shade of blue it is, but when you think about that shade of blue (as an english speaker for example) your brain might group it with a bunch of similar blues and classify it as "light" blue. Another person who's language has names for multiple different blues might place it in a category with different blues than the english speaker. Does this make sense?
    It's similar for emotions. You might see a sad face and register it as really sad, but a person from a different culture might register it as less sad than you would.

    Does this go along with what you were saying or against it? I kind of got carried away...

  3. #473
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corastaur View Post
    I agree and disagree with you at the same time. Yes the language you speak won't change the colors or the information that your brain is taking in.
    Agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by corastaur View Post
    All of that is going to be the same for pretty much everyone regardless of the language they speak or the culture they come from. BUT the language you speak will play a role in how your brain processes the information.
    Okay?

    Quote Originally Posted by corastaur View Post
    Do you see what I mean? I guess your brain will probably process it the same way, but it affects how you think about the world around you. Right? So when you look at something blue, for example, your brain registers what shade of blue it is, but when you think about that shade of blue (as an english speaker for example) your brain might group it with a bunch of similar blues and classify it as "light" blue. Another person who's language has names for multiple different blues might place it in a category with different blues than the english speaker. Does this make sense?
    What doesn't make sense is the fact that you're saying that it's "language" what determinate how you process reality and generate the distinction categories. You are saying that a group makes this categories of blues, because their language determinates it, while i believe its their reality and their language is just a product of their reality. Let's say this, you don't need to know more than one white, you know that white is white, and there is no need for any other scale in that color, now think how would it be if you were a Inuit, living a place filled with ice and snow, your only way to understand the world around you is creating distinctive categories for white, as white is a color you need to dominate in the communication to make yourself understand in the group; you can't say at your brother "hey I'm going at the white house across the street", while the whole street is covered in snow. Language is a product of reality, made to understand reality. The thing is, when we clash in our language we can make this distinctions of reality wider or thiner, with the goal to really understand the object.

    Quote Originally Posted by corastaur View Post
    It's similar for emotions. You might see a sad face and register it as really sad, but a person from a different culture might register it as less sad than you would.
    No, it would depend on their own reality and how they understand sadness, again, language is just how to express their reality, and it obviously have a connection in how the perceive the world, but its not determinate and it's not for sure the only variable.

  4. #474
    Lucky Member corastaur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClockHand View Post
    What doesn't make sense is the fact that you're saying that it's "language" what determinate how you process reality and generate the distinction categories. You are saying that a group makes this categories of blues, because their language determinates it, while i believe its their reality and their language is just a product of their reality. Let's say this, you don't need to know more than one white, you know that white is white, and there is no need for any other scale in that color, now think how would it be if you were a Inuit, living a place filled with ice and snow, your only way to understand the world around you is creating distinctive categories for white, as white is a color you need to dominate in the communication to make yourself understand in the group; you can't say at your brother "hey I'm going at the white house across the street", while the whole street is covered in snow. Language is a product of reality, made to understand reality. The thing is, when we clash in our language we can make this distinctions of reality wider or thiner, with the goal to really understand the object.
    This actually makes a lot of sense! Hmmm I agree that it definitely depends on their reality. (or their environment right?) Maybe it's less the language affecting the perception, and more of a cultural affect - which is reflected in the language spoken?

  5. #475
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
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    ya, but environment is neither determinant, it just influence.

    Also in a more personal view, in spanish, or better say, where I live, we don't use the world "love" for anything more than love for someone who you are really in love, or to your parents. We actually have many words that are different scales of "love" for different situations. But the word didn't made the culture, we did it.
    Last edited by ClockHand; 05-15-2012 at 01:04 AM.

  6. #476
    Lucky Member corastaur's Avatar
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    Exactly.

    Man this is why I love psychology, its just fun to talk/think about!
    - early classes, night!

  7. #477
    Fifty Fifty Member Bacon_Barbarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ClockHand View Post
    ya, but environment is neither determinant, it just influence.

    Also in a more personal view, in spanish, or better say, where I live, we don't use the world "love" for anything more than love for someone who you are really in love, or to your parents. We actually have many words that are different scales of "love" for different situations. But the word didn't made the culture, we did it.
    But the word come from the culture, and if the culture shapes our outlook...
    My AA thread - Updated 06/28/14

    Quote Originally Posted by Celestial-Fox View Post
    You're my favorite.

  8. #478
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corastaur View Post
    Exactly.

    Man this is why I love psychology, its just fun to talk/think about!
    - early classes, night!
    I feel this is more like sociology or anthropology (the only reason why I can make some sense).

    @bacon
    Well the word is older, and so the concept (love). What I'm trying to say is that, we as a culture create all those scales of love. Different love words for different situation, persons and grades on the feeling.

  9. #479
    Fifty Fifty Member Bacon_Barbarian's Avatar
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    Yes, but not all cultures are going to have words for all the levels of love. This is only sort of related, but look at the word schadenfreude. It can't be translated as just one word in English because it's not something the English ever thought of. I'm sure you can think of some Spanish words that don't have direct and/or literal translations.
    My AA thread - Updated 06/28/14

    Quote Originally Posted by Celestial-Fox View Post
    You're my favorite.

  10. #480
    Palindrome Member ClockHand's Avatar
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    Of course, thats is the constant problem with translation. And its why is some times hard for me to explain rules of spanish, because words have a cultural connotation. But again, its because the culture, not language making the culture.

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