Page 7 of 16 FirstFirst ... 34567891011 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 70 of 153

Thread: Free will. Do we really have it?

  1. #61
    Devilish Member Inksprout's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    756
    It's not 'fate' because everything is still happening moment to moment and can't be predicted. What kodos is saying is just that all the factors which determine what we do are scientifcally out of our control. Fate is more saying that everything is predetermined and will end a certain way.

  2. #62
    Zeta Members ram's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    in your heart
    Posts
    1,503
    Sorry I already do know that but I don't know what word to say.
    Don't have that many vocabulary. OTL

    So yeah what I'm trying to ask is that we are program to do certain things, Like I was already program to type in this chatbox right now and also I'm program to join this site and talk to all of you.

  3. #63

    Cool

    Well... I might be entering this a little too late... but....

    From my point of view, if you were an omnipresent being(omnipresent, where you simply watch, not omnipotent,where you take part) that knew and understood EVERYTHING--- Everything that will happen and everything that has ever happened and the REASON behind all these "happenings"--- then everything will seem predetermined or "fixed" to you.

    But, from the standpoint of an individual being(me, for example), there are in fact LOTS of choices, on a moment to moment basis. Whether to use my right index finger or use my middle finger to type in the letter "o" for example, is entirely up to me.

    So i'd say what this omnipresent being is doing is simply predicting, you see. It isnt shaping how our lives go.

    Therefore, provided no omnipotent being had any part to play in the creation of the universe(or any bit thereafter), then I think we DO have free will.
    Last edited by raynmetal; 12-05-2011 at 10:33 AM.

  4. #64
    Zeta Members ram's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    in your heart
    Posts
    1,503
    But, from the standpoint of an individual being(me, for example), there are in fact LOTS of choices, on a moment to moment basis. Whether to use my right index finger or use my middle finger to type in the letter "o" for example, is entirely up to me.
    actually there's this, What kodos said is that the mind is a product of the brain, and the brain is made of matter.. So it still follows all the cause and effect rules of the universe.

    like how your blood flow to your heart and stuffs.

    Were no different than a mere cell, or a mere leaf that flows to the air.
    you could say were just blood cells of the universe.
    So were not entirely sure if your the one who decided where and when to push your finger in the keyboard, So yeah your kinda late on the discussion.

  5. #65
    999 Knights Member Gedeon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Boljevci, Serbia
    Posts
    1,616
    Guys.......do you realize how depressed (almost) all of you sound? I say fudge it! Maybe i am being moved by the threads of a big all mighty being, maybe i just do what that little atom in one of my neurons told me to do.........im still going to have fun with it!!! My nephew just read this and said "So should i just let fate do everything?" HELL NO! I see us (humans) as little dust particals in the universe that nobody cares about. We will be here for some time, leave some record of us being here, the planet will be destroyed into space dust and it will be as if were never existed So until the day my little cells in my brain stop working im gonna have as much fun as i can!!! Now im off to eat.
    Problem?
    Quote Originally Posted by GunZet View Post
    Mmm, yes, considering he's Serbian, he might.... overwork the ladies. Don't need that.

  6. #66
    Bad Enough Dude to Rescue the President Kodos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    3,026
    Quote Originally Posted by raynmetal View Post
    Well... I might be entering this a little too late... but....

    From my point of view, if you were an omnipresent being(omnipresent, where you simply watch, not omnipotent,where you take part) that knew and understood EVERYTHING--- Everything that will happen and everything that has ever happened and the REASON behind all these "happenings"--- then everything will seem predetermined or "fixed" to you.
    That is omniscience, not omnipresence.

    But, from the standpoint of an individual being(me, for example), there are in fact LOTS of choices, on a moment to moment basis. Whether to use my right index finger or use my middle finger to type in the letter "o" for example, is entirely up to me.
    That is how it seems. But seeming is not reality. Also if the future is fixed then it is fixed. If I am thinking of a number and you cannot guess it, that does not mean I am not thinking of a particular number. Just because your perspective is unable to grasp the reality does not mean the reality ceases to be reality.

    So i'd say what this omnipresent being is doing is simply predicting, you see. It isnt shaping how our lives go.
    If you are able to predict the future with 100% accuracy then the future is predetermined by definition. Effect follows cause with or without intervention.

    Therefore, provided no omnipotent being had any part to play in the creation of the universe(or any bit thereafter), then I think we DO have free will.
    There are no omnipotent beings and even if they were it would be irellavent to this. 1 + 1 = 2. Period. Effect follows cause. The universe is deterministic and free will is an illusion born of complexity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gedeon View Post
    Guys.......do you realize how depressed (almost) all of you sound? I say fudge it! Maybe i am being moved by the threads of a big all mighty being, maybe i just do what that little atom in one of my neurons told me to do.........im still going to have fun with it!!! My nephew just read this and said "So should i just let fate do everything?" HELL NO! I see us (humans) as little dust particals in the universe that nobody cares about. We will be here for some time, leave some record of us being here, the planet will be destroyed into space dust and it will be as if were never existed So until the day my little cells in my brain stop working im gonna have as much fun as i can!!! Now im off to eat.
    Who said anything about despair or depression? I may be an automaton following purely mechanical rules, but here, now, these illusions are real to me and they have meaning. Does it mater why I am able to laugh or to love? Or is what matters the fact I can do these things and that, to me anyway, they are beautiful? I say it is the latter.

    Do you like big boobs? Dragons? Ninja? Martial arts? Wizards? Then click here and make all your wildest dreams come true!!

  7. #67
    999 Knights Member Gedeon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Boljevci, Serbia
    Posts
    1,616
    read the the first sentence....
    Problem?
    Quote Originally Posted by GunZet View Post
    Mmm, yes, considering he's Serbian, he might.... overwork the ladies. Don't need that.

  8. #68
    Fenn
    Guest
    This leads me to ask what is (or is there) the purpose of the illusion free will. Is it an evolutionary design? Simply a coincidence? A bi-product of rational thought?

  9. #69
    Super Senior Member Delphinus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    2,348
    Does quantum mechanics allow for the existence of free will in the traditional sense?

    Part of its definition is that no one outcome can be determined on the subatomic level, only a distribution of probable outcomes. We don't know what influences the ultimate 'decision' of a particle. It could be something related to the mind and consciousness, allowing free will, or it might be completely random, or it might vary depending on circumstances, or any of a number of options.

    I'm agnostic but I like to think we have genuine free will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenn
    You forgot your F in Modesty.

  10. #70
    Zeta Members ram's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    in your heart
    Posts
    1,503
    I'm with Del, I won't underestimate the human brain.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •