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Fenn
06-01-2011, 10:09 PM
"Fenn actually makes art?"

Yes, yes I do. I just recently downloaded PAINT.net, and with help from tutorials by Greg Martin (posted by Rio) I am determined to start working on spacescapes. I'll update as I produce new works.

6/1/11: My first solo attempt at a starfield
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-star-field-1-2.png?t=4de6f06a3a69a

6/2/11: attempt #2 at a star field + dust-like figure
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-star-field-2-jpeg-3.jpg?t=4de7bca21f335

6/2/11: Had a chance to try a planet and starscape:
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-star-field-3-jpeg-4.jpg?t=4de841f5b0670


Thanks for all the crits so far. I've really tried to implement some of the suggestions.
Any other crits or advice from experienced spacescape creators would be appreciated.

nisaren
06-01-2011, 10:57 PM
I'm not an experienced spacescape creator but I think adding some color would make this look a lot more interesting.

I would suggest maybe having three layers that you work on. The top layer you have your brightest/largest stars, the middle layer you have medium brightness stars, and finally the bottom layer will be the dimmest layer. Then between the middle and bottom layers put another layer and put some soft colors that are fairly desaturated. Between the top two layers you can do other similar colors that are more saturated.

I'm not sure how Paint.net works, if you can have textured brushes or anything, but a textured brush would be awesome for adding random color gradations into the piece to make it look kind of like nebulae.

At any rate, not sure if this helps, but that's how I would approach one of these paintings if I was to try it. ^^;

ram
06-02-2011, 09:19 AM
I'm not a experienced spacescape creator so you shouldn't take my advise if you don't want to...

i don't know how paint.net works but the hardness of the brush is too much and those points looks like square when zoomed..
in photoshop there is a pencil and a brush tool... if it's the same for paint.net then i suggest you use brush with zero hardness... that happens when you use pencil..

and if you use photoshop you could use layer style...
which you can use drop shadow and inner shadow and outer glow..

hope this helps.. i'm a newbie in criticism and a newbie in mt so if this doesn't help please don't reply so much harsh things to me.. =_=

Fenn
06-02-2011, 10:53 AM
I'm not an experienced spacescape creator but I think adding some color would make this look a lot more interesting.

I would suggest maybe having three layers that you work on. The top layer you have your brightest/largest stars, the middle layer you have medium brightness stars, and finally the bottom layer will be the dimmest layer. Then between the middle and bottom layers put another layer and put some soft colors that are fairly desaturated. Between the top two layers you can do other similar colors that are more saturated.

I'm not sure how Paint.net works, if you can have textured brushes or anything, but a textured brush would be awesome for adding random color gradations into the piece to make it look kind of like nebulae.

At any rate, not sure if this helps, but that's how I would approach one of these paintings if I was to try it. ^^;

Great suggestions. Three layers is a good idea; the tutorial only had two and as a newbie I wasn't going to deviate on the first try. I did attempt to add color, but it was very weak and I used purple (bad idea).


I'm using paint.net without any plugins, which means I don't have texture brushes or any of the fancy photoshop stuff, which limits me, but I think some creativity will help me work around it.


I'm not a experienced spacescape creator so you shouldn't take my advise if you don't want to...

i don't know how paint.net works but the hardness of the brush is too much and those points looks like square when zoomed..
in photoshop there is a pencil and a brush tool... if it's the same for paint.net then i suggest you use brush with zero hardness... that happens when you use pencil..

and if you use photoshop you could use layer style...
which you can use drop shadow and inner shadow and outer glow..

hope this helps.. i'm a newbie in criticism and a newbie in mt so if this doesn't help please don't reply so much harsh things to me.. =_=

I didn't use a brush at all for this actually. I copied the star layer, blurred it, and colorized it, then blended it onto the star layer. You are right about the large stars; a slight blur might help.

Edit: added second image

nisaren
06-02-2011, 02:33 PM
As far as the second picture goes, that's a good start. What I would do to make it look better in photoshop would be to first copy the color layer a couple times. On the lowest copied layer I would apply a pretty strong gaussian blur and reduce the opacity to about 20-30%. Then I would take the second layer and apply another gaussian blur but not as strongly and leave it at the same opacity as the other, this way you're building up the colors more. The last layer I would blur just a bit and then leave it at a 50% opacity. Note: This is all guess work, I would fiddle around with this until I got it to look closer to what I want.

After this you may want to add more texture. To do this you can take an eraser and erase a little here and there on various layers. After doing that, you may have unnaturally hard edges, so you can blur those a little either by using an eraser with a softer edge or lasso a couple areas and apply blur to the selected areas taking care not to select all the hard edges to give a mixture of soft and hard edges.

Obviously repeat or change things how you see fit, but maybe this will help you a little. Once again I don't know exactly what you can do in Paint.net. Hope this isn't too confusing to read through. D:

Fenn
06-02-2011, 10:11 PM
Added a third image. I can see a little improvement but I still have a long way to go!


As far as the second picture goes, that's a good start. What I would do to make it look better in photoshop would be to first copy the color layer a couple times. On the lowest copied layer I would apply a pretty strong gaussian blur and reduce the opacity to about 20-30%. Then I would take the second layer and apply another gaussian blur but not as strongly and leave it at the same opacity as the other, this way you're building up the colors more. The last layer I would blur just a bit and then leave it at a 50% opacity. Note: This is all guess work, I would fiddle around with this until I got it to look closer to what I want.

After this you may want to add more texture. To do this you can take an eraser and erase a little here and there on various layers. After doing that, you may have unnaturally hard edges, so you can blur those a little either by using an eraser with a softer edge or lasso a couple areas and apply blur to the selected areas taking care not to select all the hard edges to give a mixture of soft and hard edges.

Obviously repeat or change things how you see fit, but maybe this will help you a little. Once again I don't know exactly what you can do in Paint.net. Hope this isn't too confusing to read through. D:

That does help. I wish Paint.net had edges on brushes and erasers, but I can still work with the suggestions you gave me. Thanks!

Edit 6/3/11: practice with nebulae (thanks nisaren!)

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-nebula-1-jpeg-2.jpg

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-nebula-2-jpeg-3.jpg

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-spacescape-1-jpeg-2.jpg

Rio
06-04-2011, 11:11 PM
Nice progress! It's good to see some starscapes from ya. What's Paint.NET like? Is it similar to Paint except with more options and capabilities?

Fenn
06-05-2011, 11:19 AM
Nice progress! It's good to see some starscapes from ya. What's Paint.NET like? Is it similar to Paint except with more options and capabilities?

It might be because it's the first software I've got experience with outside of paint, but it's amazing. I don't own photoshop, but I have played around with it, and I'd say the scale is something like this:

|-------------------------------|----------------|
Paint___________________Paint.net_______Photoshop

It's way more powerful than paint; you have effects, infinite color options (A color wheel plus Hues, Saturation, Alpha value, etc.), gradient, lasso, magic wand tools, and effects like blurs and distortions. However, it lacks the convenience of Photoshop; lots of effects that you can perform in one touch with Photoshop require creative workarounds and improvisation in Paint.net (the glow around planets is an example). There are plugins available free online that add extra functionality, but I haven't tried any yet (one called shape 3D creates a far more effective sphere effect than the default bulge effect I'm using). Overall it's perfect for what I wanted to do.

Also, I finally decided to put everything I've been practicing together:
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-celestial-nursery.jpg?t=4deb9e356e84e

nisaren
06-05-2011, 11:39 AM
Very nice on the last one. I definitely think it's your best so far. My only suggestion now is to try looking at images of celestial objects and try to see if you can mimic them. It really helps to have a reference to work with.

Fenn
06-05-2011, 05:38 PM
Very nice on the last one. I definitely think it's your best so far. My only suggestion now is to try looking at images of celestial objects and try to see if you can mimic them. It really helps to have a reference to work with.

Thanks! And thanks for your help and advice.

Celestial-Fox
06-05-2011, 07:32 PM
I think your biggest challenge right now is getting the gaseous masses to look gaseous rather than, say, solid or gel-like. For instance, the nebulae you've attempted are very, very opaque. Try lowering the opacity and varying the values in the mass in order to get a more airy, natural look to them. I've done some spacescape work before, and I know how tough it is! <3

Fenn
06-05-2011, 07:41 PM
I think your biggest challenge right now is getting the gaseous masses to look gaseous rather than, say, solid or gel-like. For instance, the nebulae you've attempted are very, very opaque. Try lowering the opacity and varying the values in the mass in order to get a more airy, natural look to them. I've done some spacescape work before, and I know how tough it is! <3

Good tips. And yes it's tough, but it's so fun!

Cloudy
06-05-2011, 07:50 PM
The last one is looking good! does paint.net have blur? I'm not sure but in the last one i think the planet would look more realistic if it was blurred just a bit on the details and continents the effect behind it looks much nicer than the previous attempts I think you are getting the hang of this fast ;D

Fenn
06-21-2011, 03:07 PM
Well, I took some people's advice, as well as looked at some Hubble photos, and tried my hand at a nebula again. This is my best result:

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-nebula-4-jpeg-jpg.jpg?t=4e00eb4868d4b

erikamae
06-21-2011, 10:18 PM
Nebula's are the best thing ever.
Very cool man. Very cool., what kind of Nebula were
you trying to portray ? o:

Scarletlight
06-22-2011, 04:08 AM
I have no idea how you make these. They look awesome though.

ram
06-22-2011, 07:10 AM
I have no idea how you make these. They look awesome though.

were at the same boat... I wonder if there are any artist here doing something your doing fenn.. =_=
it does looks good to me and that's the only thing i could say...
you could install Google earth... there's a application there where you can go to space... you can use those as reference
(i seen a lot of nebula galaxy and milky-way galaxy using that)

Fenn
06-22-2011, 09:19 AM
Nebula's are the best thing ever.
Very cool man. Very cool., what kind of Nebula were
you trying to portray ? o:

Thanks! I was using a circular nebula (can't remember the name sry) as reference, it came out far different but I expected it to.


I have no idea how you make these. They look awesome though.

Thanks! Really, the toughest part is figuring out which tools in your image program work best to make a wispy effect. I'd bet there are tutorials on the internet somewhere.


were at the same boat... I wonder if there are any artist here doing something your doing fenn.. =_=
it does looks good to me and that's the only thing i could say...
you could install Google earth... there's a application there where you can go to space... you can use those as reference
(i seen a lot of nebula galaxy and milky-way galaxy using that)

I'll have to check out that Google "Space," although NASA and Google image are pretty reliable.

nisaren
06-23-2011, 10:50 AM
Each one keeps looking better. Keep at it, you're definitely improving. You may consider looking at some tutorials on how to paint realistic clouds. Nebulae are just huge clouds of dust, gases, and debris - so the painting process should be fairly similar. I look forward to seeing more. :)

Fenn
06-23-2011, 04:32 PM
Each one keeps looking better. Keep at it, you're definitely improving. You may consider looking at some tutorials on how to paint realistic clouds. Nebulae are just huge clouds of dust, gases, and debris - so the painting process should be fairly similar. I look forward to seeing more. :)

Are you reading my mind? That's what I've been doing...and thanks!

Edit: The best of my attempts today! I experimented with adding larger stars (made by myself, no lens flare render needed!)

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-nebula-7-jpeg-8.jpg?t=4e03d778b4949

Edit: added another

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/06/Fenn-spacescape-3-jpeg-4.jpg?t=4e04ae55d5fe0

Okay, to further my improvement, if anyone has any ideas for spacescapes they would like me to try, post them and I will use it for practice. Also, if you happen to be looking for a new wallpaper, post the res of your monitor and I will work on a canvas with that ratio so you can download it. I'm still not very experienced yet so just don't get your hopes up. (at least it's free!)

Sho
06-25-2011, 09:55 AM
Woah :0 Spacescapes are awesome. One thing about the larger stars in the first one of the two. In the rightmost and leftmost star the plus signs kinda things have one line horizontally and one vertically, but on the star in the middle it's rotated. Try to keep those things aligned, like here : http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/images/hs-2002-10-c-web.jpg

See that they can be rotated, but they're all aligned? :> Idk if you actually already knew this and it just happened, but I thought I'd just post it anyways.

Fenn
06-25-2011, 10:36 AM
Woah :0 Spacescapes are awesome. One thing about the larger stars in the first one of the two. In the rightmost and leftmost star the plus signs kinda things have one line horizontally and one vertically, but on the star in the middle it's rotated. Try to keep those things aligned, like here : http://imgsrc.hubblesite.org/hu/db/images/hs-2002-10-c-web.jpg

See that they can be rotated, but they're all aligned? :> Idk if you actually already knew this and it just happened, but I thought I'd just post it anyways.

Whoops...much abliged.

Ruther_3429
06-25-2011, 02:05 PM
Cool stuff man, how about trying to add some reflected light? If there's a large lightsource next to a nebula you're going to see the color of the light reflected in that area (with highlights etc.).

Fenn
06-25-2011, 07:23 PM
Cool stuff man, how about trying to add some reflected light? If there's a large lightsource next to a nebula you're going to see the color of the light reflected in that area (with highlights etc.).

Good idea! Gonna have to try it.

I'm also having another issue that maybe some digital artists can help with. To get the texture of many of my nebula, I use a new layer above it, set to blend mode "overlay," and render clouds. The problem is, the cloud layer covers the whole screen, and the only reason it doesn't show up is the black background. This limits me to only one texture layer because if I add a second one it will cover ALL the layers below it. Most clouds are going to have a different texture, so what can I do?

I've tried making new nebulae layers with a new texture in a different image, flattening that image and copy/pasting it into a new layer on my image, but then it has the black background. If I delete the black, the cloud render shows up everywhere. If I crop the cloud layer to only be where the nebulae is, it has a very ugly rough outline, which I can't blur out without blurring the texture. Any ideas?

Fenn
07-22-2011, 09:31 AM
Okay, I need help badly.

I can't get the lighting and shading of nebula properly. I always end up with a flat, clearly 2D shape with some half-assed texture. I won't even bother posting something new because it's gonna look like the last 2 or 3 works I've done. There's no variety in my hebula either save for the color; they all look the same.

ram
07-22-2011, 09:58 AM
well sometimes blur doesn't help, you could try lowering the opacity of the eraser,
color don't blend in with the other layer unless you put some rim-lighting or the color shouldn't be that obvious with the background color, (well space isn't my style so i don't know) but in drawing people there are two shadows (one to make it look 3d and one from where the light is coming) but in that type of thing i don't really know how to make it 3d look..

i would just suggest you go make some strong bright red light in the form of smoke in the middle, well that's the only thing i could come up with while looking into reference from google.

Fenn
07-25-2011, 05:19 PM
Okay, trying some lighting, let me know how to improve:
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/07/Fenn-nebula-10-image-11.png?t=4e2dddca076b1

nisaren
07-26-2011, 07:08 AM
Wow man, you've improved a lot since you last posted anything. Very cool vortex you've got going on. If you want to study how to do lighting for nebulas, just look up pictures of various clouds (dust clouds, mist, fog, etc.) and apply how they're lit to you nebulas.

Fenn
07-26-2011, 10:23 AM
Wow man, you've improved a lot since you last posted anything. Very cool vortex you've got going on. If you want to study how to do lighting for nebulas, just look up pictures of various clouds (dust clouds, mist, fog, etc.) and apply how they're lit to you nebulas.

This is uplifting! And that's exactly what I've been doing; it's good to know I'm on the right track!

EDIT: Full spacescape with an attempt at lighting, kinda failed with the lighting part though. Also the planet looked much better but I had to lower the quality to upload. Go to my artwork on my profile to see the smaller version.

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/07/Fenn-spacescape-3-5.png?t=4e2f06ebae1e3

Gedeon
07-26-2011, 07:53 PM
@v@ preatty....................................nothing else to add sorry. Its pretty amazing what you do here, but would you dare answer to my challenge and try to paint a Pulsar after a super now +w+

ram
07-27-2011, 06:18 PM
why is the star like that? why is it in the form of diamond? i think it would be nice if you use lens flare. and you should use smudge more on those blue clouds.

and the glow on the planet shouldn't be that glowy on the dark side of the planet

Fenn
07-27-2011, 06:58 PM
why is the star like that? why is it in the form of diamond? i think it would be nice if you use lens flare. and you should use smudge more on those blue clouds.

and the glow on the planet shouldn't be that glowy on the dark side of the planet

I'll admit the glow was my fault 100%

Unfortunately, I don't have lens flare or smudge. Gotta find the plugins for those.

ram
07-27-2011, 07:08 PM
=_= greg martin used photoshop in his tutorial if i remember reading the intro once.. don't really know how you do those things without photoshop.

though there is replacement for smudge if you have water on paint.net

Fenn
07-27-2011, 08:49 PM
=_= greg martin used photoshop in his tutorial if i remember reading the intro once.. don't really know how you do those things without photoshop.

though there is replacement for smudge if you have water on paint.net

Hehe your last post just encouraged me to get the plugin pack. now i have all the tools!

Fenn
07-30-2011, 12:40 PM
@v@ preatty....................................nothing else to add sorry. Its pretty amazing what you do here, but would you dare answer to my challenge and try to paint a Pulsar after a super now +w+

You bet I will:

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/07/Fenn-pulsar.png?t=4e3433c0e743f

While I was thrilled with the star, the background looks like a muddled mess in my eyes.

Gedeon
07-30-2011, 02:53 PM
@v@ Awesome! And as for the bg it IS a muddled mess of dust and gasses! Although i think the pulsar has a bit more color in the rings section, its still pretty amazing!!!!!

ram
08-04-2011, 09:31 AM
and i agree with ged that pulsar should have more rings to it. like this (http://www.google.com.ph/imgres?q=Pulsar&um=1&hl=en&tbm=isch&tbnid=8iH6O_RDb0OSGM:&imgrefurl=http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/universo/pulsars10.htm&docid=2EpLW272wOQ8AM&w=3000&h=2400&ei=Z5s6Tuq8GMX7mAXvopC5Bw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=939&vpy=235&dur=733&hovh=201&hovw=251&tx=146&ty=102&page=1&tbnh=120&tbnw=149&start=0&ndsp=65&ved=1t:429,r:16,s:0&biw=1920&bih=931)
first i'd just like to ask if you have a tablet. cause if you do you can just draw something exactly like this with lines of strokes with soft brush and control of the pen pressure.

does paint.net have a liquify? cause if it does i'm sure it'll help

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvEJlsnC_DY

Fenn
08-07-2011, 06:36 PM
and i agree with ged that pulsar should have more rings to it. like this (http://www.google.com.ph/imgres?q=Pulsar&um=1&hl=en&tbm=isch&tbnid=8iH6O_RDb0OSGM:&imgrefurl=http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/universo/pulsars10.htm&docid=2EpLW272wOQ8AM&w=3000&h=2400&ei=Z5s6Tuq8GMX7mAXvopC5Bw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=939&vpy=235&dur=733&hovh=201&hovw=251&tx=146&ty=102&page=1&tbnh=120&tbnw=149&start=0&ndsp=65&ved=1t:429,r:16,s:0&biw=1920&bih=931)
first i'd just like to ask if you have a tablet. cause if you do you can just draw something exactly like this with lines of strokes with soft brush and control of the pen pressure.

does paint.net have a liquify? cause if it does i'm sure it'll help

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvEJlsnC_DY

You're right, more lines.

And Paint.net does have liquify, but I'm still learning how to use it. Also thanks for the tut.

ram
08-07-2011, 08:08 PM
it's not my tutorial though. I usually see galaxies as more of like in the form of smoke. like this one (http://www.google.com.ph/imgres?q=nebula+galaxy&um=1&hl=en&sa=N&biw=1920&bih=931&tbm=isch&tbnid=G7oYnYjoRdPPHM:&imgrefurl=http://universe-beauty.com/Space-photos/Hubble/The-Great-Carina-Nebula-10199p.html&docid=uF_zANkU3vtNsM&w=2000&h=1318&ei=7Cg_ToaPK4vqmAXOzaz6Bw&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=462&vpy=248&dur=395&hovh=163&hovw=241&tx=165&ty=79&page=1&tbnh=115&tbnw=153&start=0&ndsp=65&ved=1t:429,r:13,s:0) <strike>atleast in my eyes they look like that</strike>
so i thought it would be nice if you find stuffs of how to make a smoke

Leannah
09-06-2011, 03:20 PM
The last pic looks dreamy. I like it cause it calms me down <3

Fenn
09-20-2011, 06:53 PM
It's time. MANGA TIME! I finally got arounds to uploading some of my manga. I'll admit most of this is old and the images are probably not in chronological order.

Notes:
- A lot of these are old and they probably aren't in the order I drew them.
- I took pics of them with my phone's camera. The quality is low.
- Nothing is inked. Just pencil.

With that in mind, I'd absolutely LOVE critiques, complements, anything you have to say! Also, if you have any suggestions for stuff you'd like to see, I'm in need of some new ideas. I already had someone suggest a solar flare spacescape so anything goes here.

Anyway, to the art!

Some faces I did a few years back:
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0086-jpg.jpg?t=4e79189da4eb0
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0087-jpg.jpg?t=4e7918babd6c2
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0090-jpg.jpg?t=4e7918cbc9496

An interesting character. I wonder what his name is?
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0089-jpg.jpg?t=4e7919031e53c

Some creature work. Some of it's old, some is from within a year:
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0091-jpg.jpg?t=4e7919331396c
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0092-jpg.jpg?t=4e79194605547
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0084-jpg.jpg?t=4e7919587b650
http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/09/Fenn-photo0085-jpg.jpg?t=4e791967f040d

ram
09-21-2011, 11:06 PM
everything's fine and you seem to know the basics, all you have to learn now is what size should be the face inside the whole head, size of eye and size of nose bridge and stuffs like that.

before I start, note that in reality there's no such thing as a symmetrical face. so this could be different if your aiming for different style, but as I can see, I see so much of my past drawings similar to yours,
http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/ee388/skyramiel/Fenn-photo0087-jpg.jpg
placement of everything seems to be good except mouth seems to be too far from the nose.
shape of the face is far too wide comparison to the [eye, nose, mouth]
try and make some shadow shading to know how to define the whole face in and know it's shape. for more information go and look for "how to draw anime and game characters volume 1" and download it and read it.

http://i1225.photobucket.com/albums/ee388/skyramiel/correction.png

Fenn
09-22-2011, 10:52 PM
Thanks ram! I've always had trouble orienting the face on the head. I think it has to do with my lack of experience and ability to visualize in 3-D. I'm drawing as if it's a flat plane.

Fenn
10-21-2011, 10:44 PM
Much delayed, but the solar flare spacescape requested by...someone i can't remember:

http://www.mangatutorials.com/file/pic/photo/2011/10/Fenn-solar-flare.png?t=4ea22dd946a1f