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Phoenix
11-24-2011, 04:20 AM
Hello everyone. :cat_hi:
I'm new to this forum so..

I have in a long time wanted to make my own manga. But I am "shit" at making good stories for it. But I have finally come up with something I think might work.
But I would really like if you would read the storyplot, and tell if you think it would be a good story for a manga, and what I maybe could do with and so on. :cat_huh:


Dreams

The main character (a guy) somehow comes into some sort of dream world. (Don't really know how yet? Ideas?) And in this dream world, he literally gets run into by a girl, who turns out to be a "fallen Angel". She has escaped from the hands of an evil scientist, who are experimenting her. (He want to use here power for bad things. Yea she has some kind of powers) Then the main character, is helping this fallen angel, from getting cought again, and also he must help her reach the port to heaven, before she runs out of energy. It is weakening for her to be down on earth, and she must get back to heaven before she is all out, and dies. (also have an idea, that they get some sort of item, that gives her the energy back, right before she is all out?)
The guy and the girl, (ofcourse) fall in love at the end, and when they are about to kiss, before she goes back to heaven, right before their lips touch, she fades away into heaven. The guy then wake up, and find himself in his room. Thinks to
himself. It was only a dream. The next day at school, a new student starts in his class. The fallen angel from his dreams. Their eyes meet, and the story ends.



Please tell me what you think of the plot, and if you have some ideas for the things written inside the ( ). :cat_shiney:

Hope you like it.

AlphaShard
11-27-2011, 05:14 PM
... It is so... generic... dude, that is so like an AI shoujo (starts fake/robot/dream, ends real)
EDIT: Post in the Welcome Wagon.

Bacon_Barbarian
11-28-2011, 12:17 AM
Ignore Alpha, this is where it belongs. He's right though, it's very generic, you have so little fleshed out. And how can some boy help her, if she can't do anything and she has powers? How did he get there in the first place.

Fenn
11-28-2011, 12:29 AM
Hm...yes very generic but I bet you can rework it. Just decide what you DEFINITELY want to keep and the rest can be unclicheified. Yeah, just made that up.

For instance, you can keep the fallen angel but remove the dream part. And maybe pull a creative twist, like the scientist was actually going to use her powers to end world hunger and the guy ends up preventing this (ironic comedy). Or the angel is actually a demon in disguise, and is working with the scientist (tragedy). Or something else less stereotypical.

Phoenix
11-28-2011, 08:11 AM
Thanks for the comments. Again, I am not very good at making up a good story, but I'll try to make this better.
And by the way, I from Denmark, and my english is not the best yet, so I don't quite understand the word "generic".. :P

AlphaShard
11-28-2011, 09:25 AM
No, I saw it was his first post; this is in the right spot. I have not-too-good English...
Generic: Average, overused, cliched, etc

Phoenix
11-28-2011, 09:40 AM
Okay, thank you. Now your comments makes more sense ^^

Phoenix
11-28-2011, 11:32 AM
What about:
That the main character ( a guy) in the beginning finds this crystal, that opens a portal into the world where he meets the girl(the fallen angel) who has escaped from the hands of the evil guy, but it's not her he wants. He wants the crystal which the boy have, but belongs to her. The crystal contains great powers which the evil guy needs to rule the world. But the girl needs it too, because it is the key, the way of getting back to heaven where she belongs. Now the guy only wants to get back to where he was before, and the crystal can again help him getting back. But it's only at one end of the world, that they'll be able to get back.
And so the story goes and they are getting hunted down by evil guys, and at some point the evil guy get a hold on the crystal, but the guy and the girl gets it back, and reaches the point where they can activate the portal..
And then the end, I haven't thought more about yet.

What do you think about that? :cat_huh:

AlphaShard
11-28-2011, 02:40 PM
Now it's generic shonen.

Phoenix
11-28-2011, 03:26 PM
Okay.. It's just hard to come up with something that is not generic.. Very hard..:cat_sigh:

Fenn
11-28-2011, 06:58 PM
Well just because it's cliche doesn't mean it won't work! The details are really what matter. Who is "the guy?" What is his past, his personality, his goals? Who is this fallen angel? What is her relationship to the guy, or the evil man? Who is the evil man? Why is he evil, what does he really want? Who else important exists in this world?

Going beyond the characters, what is this portal? Where did it come from, how does it work, why does it exist? This crystal, what makes it so powerful? Who made it, or what? How does one tap into it's power? Why does the angel need it go get back to heaven?

Obviously if all you can come up with is "It just is" the story is gonna be dull as crap. If you can come up with original answers to these and other, similar questions you can take a boring premise and turn it into a creative story people want to read.

Bacon_Barbarian
11-28-2011, 09:13 PM
Fenn is right. Cliche isn't bad. Cliches are cliche because when they're done well, they're very good. Somethings you might want to think about:

How did she get the Crystal into the boy's world?
If he had the Crystal in the beginning, how did he lose it?

Also, the more details you add, the less generic it will become. Hopefully. :)

GAbRieLWrIgHt
11-28-2011, 10:50 PM
cliche isn't always bad, as, like both fenn and bacon said, if they are done well. but honestly, just do each detail exquisitly, and it will turn out good.

Fenn
11-29-2011, 01:04 AM
Fenn is right.

Sigged.

Bacon_Barbarian
11-29-2011, 01:34 AM
I will regret that statement for the rest of my life.

ClockHand
11-29-2011, 02:58 AM
What about:
That the main character ( a guy) in the beginning finds this crystal, that opens a portal into the world where he meets the girl(the fallen angel) who has escaped from the hands of the evil guy, but it's not her he wants. He wants the crystal which the boy have, but belongs to her. The crystal contains great powers which the evil guy needs to rule the world. But the girl needs it too, because it is the key, the way of getting back to heaven where she belongs. Now the guy only wants to get back to where he was before, and the crystal can again help him getting back. But it's only at one end of the world, that they'll be able to get back.
And so the story goes and they are getting hunted down by evil guys, and at some point the evil guy get a hold on the crystal, but the guy and the girl gets it back, and reaches the point where they can activate the portal..
And then the end, I haven't thought more about yet.

What do you think about that? :cat_huh:

So the crystal will work as the Adventure Call, one that doesn't let the character to chose his own fate, because ones the character finds the crystal a portal will open transporting him to another world. Then he will meet a girl (who is obviously a angel, so I can predict he is going to fell in love and she will be the mirror of everything good in the world, even more she might be a reflect of a good all mother figure that the character is gonna fell in love later) who escapes from a evil guy (why is he evil? what does evil mean? what is his reach or influence? How does controlling the world will mean equally to be evil? what connection does he have with the hero so it can become a antagonist? Because a antagonist and a evil guy are different things and one having a object that the other wants doesn't make it to create a villain) who wants the crystal, which mean that if the character never found the crystal in first place the "evil guy" wouldn't have a motive or a goal, which will make the story even more random and weak (already the hero doesn't chose to step to the adventure and neither the villain chose his goal, it was the fate of the hero what made the villain), and even more weak is the plot if you say the crystal belong to the girl (which is obvious as you said she was a angel, and so she is the incarnation of the chains of actions) because she is from a different world than the guy who found the crystal.

At the end the story is basically a odyssey triggered by fate, a fate that neither villain, hero or others control, its just a satiric play from a childish God.

Advices:
Work your characters, you don't want them to be fantastics, you want them to be believable.
Work your antagonist, you need to create someone that reader would love to hate, or if you want to go to another direction, someone they hate to love.
Work your hero, no ones like a character that is just there waiting for things to happen, who never takes decisions or that doesn't chose a path. Show personality.
Delete every religious bullshit, not because is bad or cliche, but because you are over doing it. The fallen angel girl is a satire of an angel, not an angel.
Give real emotional goals to the characters, yes coming back home is a great story driver for the epic quest, but it doesn't have emotional power. One thing that make the Odyssey of Homer so good is that Ulises doesn't want to get home just because he is not in home, but because in there are the persons he love and the ones he promised to see again and stay with.
More characters; I'm not saying this as a rule for every story, but you have 3 characters, one the hero, the villain and the companion, in this case its a bad idea to not add other characters (with weight in the story), because if you don't every rol should be taken by the same characters. Example: in a moment you are going to reach the point of "the fake friends" in here one of the characters must trick his friend because some reason, as there are 2 only characters that are friends, the possibilities of who is going to trick who are obvious.
Read; read a lot, read like your life depend upon that. Not just comics or mangas, read books, encyclopedias, blogs, news, articles, etcetera, everything is helpful to do a story.
Follow greek principles like: Characters must be judged by their actions not their beings.

Phoenix
11-29-2011, 07:42 AM
How about that the evil man, is evil and want's to rule the world he lives in, because in his childhood, he was the one serving the highest ranked people. His parents where killed in a riot against them, and all orphans were to serve for the highest ranked. But then one day he escaped from them, and created an army of cyborgs, and went against the people who had used him in all these years.
The crystal with the great powers was only a myth, until one day, when his soldiers were on a routine check around the villages, they caught a girl that had the crystal around here neck. In a necklace. If the evil man could get a hold on that crystal his powers would be amazing, and no one could stop him.
The girl was told, when she got the necklace from her dying mom, that when ever she was in danger, she should simple just take the necklace, and say "help" and then throw it against the sky, and it would get help. The necklace would find the best suitable person to help her. In this case it ends up with our main character which name is Daichi. And it's kinda ironic because Daichi is not the adventure, brave, fighter kind of guy. He is like the oppisite...

Fenn
11-29-2011, 10:11 AM
So the crystal will work as the Adventure Call, one that doesn't let the character to chose his own fate, because ones the character finds the crystal a portal will open transporting him to another world. Then he will meet a girl (who is obviously a angel, so I can predict he is going to fell in love and she will be the mirror of everything good in the world, even more she might be a reflect of a good all mother figure that the character is gonna fell in love later) who escapes from a evil guy (why is he evil? what does evil mean? what is his reach or influence? How does controlling the world will mean equally to be evil? what connection does he have with the hero so it can become a antagonist? Because a antagonist and a evil guy are different things and one having a object that the other wants doesn't make it to create a villain) who wants the crystal, which mean that if the character never found the crystal in first place the "evil guy" wouldn't have a motive or a goal, which will make the story even more random and weak (already the hero doesn't chose to step to the adventure and neither the villain chose his goal, it was the fate of the hero what made the villain), and even more weak is the plot if you say the crystal belong to the girl (which is obvious as you said she was a angel, and so she is the incarnation of the chains of actions) because she is from a different world than the guy who found the crystal.

At the end the story is basically a odyssey triggered by fate, a fate that neither villain, hero or others control, its just a satiric play from a childish God.

Advices:
Work your characters, you don't want them to be fantastics, you want them to be believable.
Work your antagonist, you need to create someone that reader would love to hate, or if you want to go to another direction, someone they hate to love.
Work your hero, no ones like a character that is just there waiting for things to happen, who never takes decisions or that doesn't chose a path. Show personality.
Delete every religious bullshit, not because is bad or cliche, but because you are over doing it. The fallen angel girl is a satire of an angel, not an angel.
Give real emotional goals to the characters, yes coming back home is a great story driver for the epic quest, but it doesn't have emotional power. One thing that make the Odyssey of Homer so good is that Ulises doesn't want to get home just because he is not in home, but because in there are the persons he love and the ones he promised to see again and stay with.
More characters; I'm not saying this as a rule for every story, but you have 3 characters, one the hero, the villain and the companion, in this case its a bad idea to not add other characters (with weight in the story), because if you don't every rol should be taken by the same characters. Example: in a moment you are going to reach the point of "the fake friends" in here one of the characters must trick his friend because some reason, as there are 2 only characters that are friends, the possibilities of who is going to trick who are obvious.
Read; read a lot, read like your life depend upon that. Not just comics or mangas, read books, encyclopedias, blogs, news, articles, etcetera, everything is helpful to do a story.
Follow greek principles like: Characters must be judged by their actions not their beings.

Agreed on just about everything...until you suggested reading encyclopedias. :cat_shy:


How about that the evil man, is evil and want's to rule the world he lives in, because in his childhood, he was the one serving the highest ranked people. His parents where killed in a riot against them, and all orphans were to serve for the highest ranked. But then one day he escaped from them, and created an army of cyborgs, and went against the people who had used him in all these years.
The crystal with the great powers was only a myth, until one day, when his soldiers were on a routine check around the villages, they caught a girl that had the crystal around here neck. In a necklace. If the evil man could get a hold on that crystal his powers would be amazing, and no one could stop him.
The girl was told, when she got the necklace from her dying mom, that when ever she was in danger, she should simple just take the necklace, and say "help" and then throw it against the sky, and it would get help. The necklace would find the best suitable person to help her. In this case it ends up with our main character which name is Daichi. And it's kinda ironic because Daichi is not the adventure, brave, fighter kind of guy. He is like the oppisite...

Getting better. Still, however, it feels like you are creating plot elements to fit your mold, rather than the plot driving the story. It's kinda like you went, "Okay, so I need a reason for the guy to be evil. I know!" This isn't always bad, but it's best to avoid this process, especially if we can pick it out right away.

I mean, of course someone's gonna be pissed if they had to serve upper class snobs. There are still questions to be answered here. Where on earth did he get the funds and resources to build giant robots? Why did this girl's mom happen to have the necklace of superpower?

Now, this time, as you think through these questions, don't just look for a quick fix for your answers like "Oh btw the evil guy got his robot army in a scrapyard." Make the answer meaningful. If he really did get everything from a dump, make that show how creative/intellectual he is, and how determined he is to conquer them. If he got funding from some rich person, bring them into the plot as well. Is this person the true evil (this is cliche too but its something), or did they make a mistake by helping them and want to correct it by aiding the hero?

Phoenix
11-29-2011, 10:46 AM
If he really did get everything from a dump, make that show how creative/intellectual he is, and how determined he is to conquer them.

The purpose was to make him this creative/intellectual guy.

I may sound stupid now.. but.. I don't quite understand what you want me to do exactly..:monkey_ehheh:
Again, I am "shit" at making good stories..
But I am really really happy that you are trying to help me :cat_whyyou:

Fenn
11-29-2011, 03:18 PM
Haha I was worried we were nitpicking a little too much. Essentially, what you've given us isn't a fully fleshout out story but a basic premise. And for the function of a premise, you're actually doing fine. I think I went a bit overboard with the critique because I was looking at it like a full-out storyboard.

Here's the bottom line: you have a fairly common framework for you story laid out. I'm not going to lie, this concept doesn't contain that many unique hooks. However, that's okay. Now, your job is to decide whether the idea you've presented is something you really want to use in a story. If you do, then that's good! The next step is to start fleshing out the story, and this is something you should spend plenty of time brainstorming and tossing ideas around for. THIS is where the bulk of creativity comes from, adding the details and specifics to the story.

As you begin adding characters, events, locations, and important objects to the story, you might find yourself wanting to tweak or change the basic plot. If so, go for it! Nothing's set in stone until you finish that final copy.

Shuro
12-03-2011, 05:50 AM
I agree with Fenn, fully.

It might seem hard, but just use your imagination. Honestly, if I would make him seem stupid at the beginning, while working for the nobles, but during his time as a servant(or whatever), have him research and what not, studying every aspect. I assume this kingdom is high tech(I didn't really read it all). And if so, maybe this 'Angel' could possibly be one of his defective cyborg(still cliche, but eh), who kind of drifted away. Perhaps you might believe she has a 'mother' but in actuality, it is illusion in itself, that the scientist put in her 'mind'.

And if you are thinking it, I wouldn't do the whole, 'Guy falls in love with Angel'. It is kind of cliche, as stated before. It is nice, but it is like a piece of gum you love. You like it for that short while, but then you grow tired of it.

Anyways good luck. :)

If you want, you can look at my thread or others, to get ideas of story plotting.

Phoenix
12-14-2011, 03:12 AM
Hello again. :cat_hi:
I have come up with a new idea.. It's still based a little on the Dreams storyplot I made.. but it's a little different.
Dropped the angel thing.. couldn't get that to work..

It has no title yet, so if you have an idea, please let me know.

Fun thing, I had just gone to bed, when I thought of this. Then because I wanted to remember it, I had to get up and write it down so I didn't forgot it. :P

But here it is. Please tell me what you think^^

It plays in some sort of midieval time, but they have technology.. so..
Or maybe is could be steampunk.. Really like that style.. Tell me what you think ^^


Storyplot

The main character (a boy) sits after school, watching out the window, when suddenly he sees a bright light from the sky. Right after that, a thing crashes through the window, and get stuck in his table.
When he comes to himself, after the great shock, he finds out that it was a crystal that crashed through the window. And because he is very curious, he reaches out to grab it. But right as he touches it, he disappears in a bright, white light.
He now find himself to be in a forest, and he starts to look around. Something in the bushes scares him, and he starts to run. He runs into this girl, who is on the run from the evil guys henchmen. She then grabs hold on the main character, and they manage to shake them off and hide.
She tells him, that it is she that has sent the crystal to find someone to help her on her mission to give the crystal to the father*. She cannot face that journey alone. She doesn’t have the powers to it alone.
She is a witch, and she is the only survivor from when her village was destroyed by the evil guys. Before her grandfather, the eldest wizard in the village**, died, he gave her the crystal and told her to bring it to the father.
The story then builds up around this quest, and at the end, there will be an epic battle between the witches and the evil guys. Our hero is the only one who can defeat the leader of the evil guys.
The evil guy want the crystal, because it contains great powers that he would use for bad things.


*The father is the highest wizard of them all. He contains all powers of all witches and wizards in the world. And if he were to die, all the witches and wizards would lose their powers.

**The eldest witch or wizard(depends on which sex they are) in the village, has a piece of the father in form of a crystal. It contains all the powers from all witches and wizards in that village. Without the crystal, they wouldn’t have any powers. As long as the crystal is with the eldest, all have their powers.

Bacon_Barbarian
12-22-2011, 05:04 PM
Much better. Though, why is he the only one who can do it?

Phoenix
12-22-2011, 05:09 PM
Much better. Though, why is he the only one who can do it?

There are some things I need to work I know that. But this was only the first outcast of the idea I got. :)
I hope I am able to make this to a good manga story, and I hope I am able to finish it too :P
All the other times I have startet on a manga, I haven't finished it, but I will this time.

I have now startet on making the character designs.
Here's the male character's design.

http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee210/AtokLanzeros/Light-maincharacter2-smaller.jpg

ClockHand
12-23-2011, 10:02 AM
oh look, a Cloud.

Phoenix
12-23-2011, 12:08 PM
oh look, a Cloud.

Yea, he does look a little like Cloud. But I first saw it when I added the sword... And that's why I think I'll give him another weapon.

SuperKasey
12-30-2011, 01:37 PM
Is this your main character? I'm assuming he came from our world into a fantasy world right? If so you may want to figure out how he dressed on this side of the veil since you'll probably be drawing him that way quite a bit at first. Also, where did the sword/other weapon come from? Why does he need it? Who teaches him to use it? Why did the Crystal choose him? What does he have to offer?

Not attacking you, just things to consider.

Phoenix
12-30-2011, 09:16 PM
Yea you assumed right. In our world he is dressed in a standard japanese school uniform. White shirt, black jeans and black shoes or whatever. I know, I'll have to make a drawing of him wearing that. And I will.
For all of the questions about the sword: Don't really know about the sword yet. I just added it to the picture to make it look cool. Maybe he will have it, maybe not. Maybe some other weapon? I don't know really..
But yea, those are things I need to consider. Or just some of them.. It's a hard process coming up with a good story to tell.. :/

GAbRieLWrIgHt
12-31-2011, 12:27 AM
Haha, they have the same name as my OC.